Effects of high eth content on fuel level sensor

Discussion in 'Mazdaspeed 3/6 E85/CornFed' started by iamareios, Aug 2, 2022.

Watchers:
7 users.
  1. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    First and foremost I am tuned for e48. This thread is to open further discussion on the topic. I have been having problems with high ethanol content and fuel level sensors failing. From research I've gathered, it seems gen 2 sensors are more prone to failure. So far I have replaced the original sensor seen in the photos with no luck. The oem replacement sensor failed in less than 2 weeks time. I have yet to pull it out, but have another on the way.

    I found other platforms have a similar issue with this type of sensor, but no real fix. My first course of action in attempting to prevent this from happening again will be cleaning this sensor of corrosion and applying an avionics "fuel lube" I discovered called EZ TURN. I'll submerge the sensor in an e50 blend and see what happens. The data sheet shows this stuff as a good candidate to slow down the problem. It's not soluble in fuel or ethanol and has dielectric properties. [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Sent from tapioca
     
    iamareios, via a mobile device, Aug 2, 2022
    #1
    • Like Like x 2
  2. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tucson
    Ratings:
    +2,717 / -3
    I'm still on my original genwon sensor and it's never had issues.
     
  3. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    Not exactly sure what the differences are between gens. Is it simply the contact terminal material is different and more ethanol friendly? Are the connectors different? Resistance values maybe.
     
    iamareios, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #3
  4. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2016
    Posts:
    2,335
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Earth
    Ratings:
    +2,788 / -14
    Gen done has a more resilient material. This seems to be a primarily gen 2 issue
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #4
    • Like Like x 2
  5. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    If that's the case, I'm willing to buy a gen 1 sensor and compare. Hell, figure out a way to run it on my pu.
     
    iamareios, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #5
  6. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2016
    Posts:
    2,335
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Earth
    Ratings:
    +2,788 / -14
    If I recall someone compared them and the way they measure the level is too different to make an easy conversion

    I wonder if you change that connector to something made with a different alloy if you would have the problem. Gold would probably work but fuck that
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #6
    • Like Like x 2
  7. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    I thought the same exact thing. Sourcing a connector similar may be difficult though
     
    iamareios, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #7
  8. L337TurboZ

    L337TurboZ Master Truck Squatter Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2020
    Posts:
    774
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Location:
    Charleston, South Carolina USA
    Ratings:
    +736 / -4
    Find a three wire variable resistor and wire it inline with the Gen 1 signal wire. Then fill the tank (or empty it) and adjust the dial till you get the desired reading. Measure the resistance of the resistor and buy a regular 10 cent resistor to wire in it's place.

    Unless you can find a way to secure the variable resistor so it doesn't change from vibration or contact.

    I had to do something similar to make an SAFC2 work on my Starion as the tach signal wasn't reading smoothly and the three wire variable resistor corrected it.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/324731405040?chn=ps&mkevt=1&mkcid=28
     
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2022
    L337TurboZ, via a Motorola device, Aug 3, 2022
    #8
  9. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tucson
    Ratings:
    +2,717 / -3
    Best bet is probably to disassemble the genpu sender and do something to protect the parts that have deteriorated in the pic.
     
  10. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    Still leaning forward on this EZ turn stuff. We'll see if smothering it on everything has any effect.
     
  11. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tucson
    Ratings:
    +2,717 / -3
    I was thinking something more permanent, like a potting or conformal coating.
     
  12. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    Ethanol and fuel safe. Similar to what ethanol content sensor boards get coated in?
     
  13. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tucson
    Ratings:
    +2,717 / -3
    Sure? Worth a shot at least. I'd avoid coating the resistor contacts though.
     
  14. Sho

    Sho Greenie Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,318
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Louisville, KY
    Ratings:
    +2,785 / -0
    @Littleloogy had a thread on this on msf. Gen 2 specific. Unfortunately can't find it in the archives. I reached out to James on fb to see if he's still got the info, but it looks like he hasn't been on there in a while
     
    Sho, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #14
    • Like Like x 2
  15. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,785
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Tucson
    Ratings:
    +2,717 / -3
    I think he's the one that first tried the dielectric grease, but found it had to be reapplied every so often or somesuch.
     
  16. Awafrican

    Awafrican Moderator Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2016
    Posts:
    3,015
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Canada
    Ratings:
    +2,312 / -9
    Remind me about this next week I've got a corrosion engineer contact I'll be able to reach out too then that may be able to have some insight
     
    Awafrican, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #16
    • Like Like x 2
  17. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    Setting reminder on phone to remind you
     
  18. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2016
    Posts:
    2,335
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Earth
    Ratings:
    +2,788 / -14
    Making that connector out of a random strip of metal wouldn't be hard just tedious
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Aug 3, 2022
    #18
  19. Mauro_Penguin

    Mauro_Penguin Punk in Drublic. #BlackLivesMatter Motorhead Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Posts:
    1,292
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Palm Beach County, FL
    Ratings:
    +1,597 / -2
    IIRC the few guys on MSF that beat this issue, did it by just soldering all the connectors together. Some kind of resistance that caused the corrosion.

    Back then my buddies with Relentless Customs tried some epoxy that worked for civic guys or something like that. The epoxy was expensive and I don't think it worked.
     
    Mauro_Penguin, via a mobile device, Aug 4, 2022
    #19
    • Like Like x 2
  20. iamareios

    iamareios Life is too short to stay stock Silver Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2017
    Posts:
    280
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    Ratings:
    +359 / -0
    Yeah I've been trying to find the thread about this to at least bring it back up on this forum. No luck so far though.
     
    iamareios, via a mobile device, Aug 4, 2022
    #20
Loading...

Share This Page

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)