High spark advance/misfiring

Discussion in 'Mazdaspeed 3 Troubleshooting' started by Lucas44, Aug 8, 2023.

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  1. Lucas44

    Lucas44 Greenie N00B Member

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    Year/Make/Model: 2009 Speed 3
    Mileage: 105K Miles
    Location: Charlotte, North Carolina (sea level)
    Concern: Spark advance is high, engine is misfiring and running hot
    DTC's: P0300 P0403 (EGR) U2064 U2619
    Modifications: Cobb FMIC, Cobb BOV, Cobb Turbo Inlet + Intake + Airbox, Cobb Boost Control (boost not changed), Autotech HPFP Internals, Corksport Injector Seals, NGK Step 1 Colder plugs, Damond EGR Complete Delete Kit
    ECU/Tuning Software: Accessport V3
    Tuner: Cobb Stage 2 OFS
    Is the concern intermittent? Progressing worse
    Can you duplicate the concern? Yes
    Recent Repairs: Injector Cleaning, Oil change (Pennzoil 5W-30 | Motorcraft Filter)
    Correction:


    Hey everybody, so just to clarify in advance I'm still relatively new to working under the hood, so please forgive me. My timing was on the slight decline before I started this project, but there wasn't anything alarming about it slapping the valve cover or causing any issues with my engine. I just recently finished installing the Cobb Stage 2 kit along with the other modifications/services listed above. It took longer than I had originally hoped (about 7 months) but I just got it back together and running again. I chose to use the off the shelf stage 2 map seeing as I used Cobb's package, and figured I would at least check to make sure the car ran properly before looking into getting it tuned by somebody more advanced. I had about a third of a tank of fuel when parked, and I refilled it to let the old gas run through with some better gas. It wasn't what I ideally wanted, but was the best solution I could find second to the attempt at siphoning it all out. For the first few times I ran it after completing the project, the car seemingly ran near perfect, excluding some extra noise from the timing. The difference from where it was before I started the project concerned me slightly, but assumed maybe it was due to it sitting for so long and having a fresh oil change. The first data log below was my return from the gas station, with the spark advance originally hovering around 12.5 at idle, but then increasing to peaks of 50+ randomly. However, I experienced no knock. The second log, I had run the car a few times in between, but this being the first time I made a very light few pulls to check boost levels. Spark advance started out at 17.5 at idle, before having a wild difference with the low being -13.5 and the absolute peak at 60 during the drive. This time there was very little knock, but never peaking above .7 even on a couple slightly harder pulls. The third log was this past weekend, with the spark advance starting out at 46.5! and where I took it on the highway briefly. After a couple of slight pulls before to recheck boost, I felt no major issues. After pulling back on the highway, I felt the immediate loss in power, even when not attempting to accelerate quickly. This is also the moment I experienced knock for a brief few seconds, peaking at 3.15. I drove it very light for the last couple miles back, and let it run at idle to make sure it stayed consistent. I then shut it off, and checked my codes again. This was the first time the P0300 (random/multiple misfire) code popped up. I pulled my spark plugs out yesterday, and with less than maybe 2 hours running time, the bottom of the plugs look to be fouling quickly, with black carbon around the bottom rings and white on the side of the ground. The engine was also physically running extremely hot, with intake temps low (around 100) but coolant temps peaking at 214. I checked each spark plug, and the gap remained 0.028.

    I know the VVT is quite the common problem on these pre-2011, especially hitting 6 digits on the odometer. However, I was wondering if that's the sole cause to most of these issues, or if there's more to it. Seeing the complexity and complications of doing the tedious timing job, I plan on looking elsewhere for this to be done, but want to get an idea where the rest of my car is at beforehand. I appreciate any and all help in advance, and thanks for your time!
     

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    Last edited: Aug 8, 2023
  2. Mazdaspeeeding

    Mazdaspeeeding Greenie N00B Member

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    Your logs are way too long. No need and No one can read that. Do a short few seconds of idle and then a wot pull… or a few seconds of cruise if that’s your issue. And log APP too, much easier to read.
    if your vvt has never been done and it’s over 100k and “it’s in decline “ as you put it and it’s making noise then I’d start there. Your spark advance is fine, they cruise at plus 45/50+ whatever and idle around 10/12 whatever or more depending on temp/accessories engaged etc. 100 intake temps snd 214 coolant is nothing to worry about. If your plugs are new, correct (ie one step colder ngk 6510s ) at 28 thou then your misfire is prolly a bad coil pack (assuming everything else is in order) They fail with mileage commonly. And Refill with good fresh 93 so we have one less variable to consider.
     
    Mazdaspeeeding, via an iPhone, Aug 10, 2023
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  3. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Motorhead Platinum Member

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    Your plugs are.foulingnbecause you don't need colder plugs
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Aug 10, 2023
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  4. Lucas44

    Lucas44 Greenie N00B Member

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    Appreciate the feedback! I was wondering if the plugs being a step colder were an issue. I got them figuring they would be fine for running stock boost, and then would also have me set for when I hope to be pushing 18-19 pounds down the road. I'll have to pick up another set of iridiums
     
  5. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Motorhead Platinum Member

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    You pretty much can run stock plugs until you upgrade the turbo
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Aug 12, 2023
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  6. Sho

    Sho Silver Member

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    Spark advance will vary by load and rpm

    At idle what you're seeing is normal. At low load cruising 40-60° is quite normal. You'll see KR at part throttle often, as the ecu will advance timing til it sees feedback and then pull out some timing as it help efficiency.

    Then when WOT, that is where you'll see lower spark advance.

    Depending on the tune and fuel used (just throwing out an example...my old ms6, on e48 fuel, aux port injection, pte 6266, 32psi peak, you'll see spark advance transition from a higher value at low load, drop down to a lower value as the car begins to build boost, then increase again with rpm). On pump gas, youd less timing at wot through the entire Rev range that what you see below.. Screenshot_20230812_113230_Sheets.jpg
     
    Sho, via a mobile device, Aug 12, 2023
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