400whp on pump w/o aux fueling

Discussion in 'Mazdaspeed 3 General Discussion' started by Poon_Flavored_Tang, Feb 10, 2016.

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  1. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    It's easiest for these cars to make peak power right around 6k for a number of reasons, which means ~355 wtq is required there; thus, you need a turbo large enough to flow that kind of air on low timing in order to get the cylinder pressures up enough to overcome rod ratio and all that jazz. Adding headwork and cams set up for that RPM would make this a cinch.
     
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  2. rfinkle2

    rfinkle2 Greenie Member

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    Not a fan of revving the cars I tune above 7500 on the stock block.. and until it is necessary (I have someone hellbent on breaking some sort of record), I'd prefer to stick to revving to 7000.
     
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  3. Redline

    Redline I done fucked up for the last time. BANNED Greenie Member

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    Pretty sure it's impossible as all the reputable tuners are saying 370-380whp (w/ 1.01 CF, smoothing of 3) is the limit on a healthy motor with a well-flowing setup. That's where I landed on E28 before adding 100% methanol. Even when adding the methanol, I stayed at ~380whp because my tuner said he advises against the risk/reward above this on stock block w/ a BNR S3. My goals were more consistent year-round performance, cooling, cleaning, and extra safety anyways.

    I definitely don't see more than 350whp happening w/o some kind of alcohol, whether methanol or ethanol. I guess some of the larger turbos are hitting more on 93, but I like BNR S3 responsiveness and I just can't get enough timing w/o alcohol to get above that power level. Besides, I don't think I'd want 400whp worth of heat in my combustion chamber on stock block. Meth/eth keep things safer/cooler/ringlands happier.
     

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    Last edited: Feb 12, 2016
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  4. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Welp. I dynoed today. See below and added a log for you to see. I was having some blowout at the end of the run. I have new NGK's to remedy that.

    upload_2016-2-13_21-41-19.png
     

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  5. Redline

    Redline I done fucked up for the last time. BANNED Greenie Member

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    12 degrees timing and 22psi to hit 415whp? Wow.

    Looks like you have a large turbo that'll flow a ton of air, based on that curve, the timing, boost, and power level. Goes to show if you go big enough, it can be done on 93. Smaller turbos like mine need alcohol to hit the necessary timing levels, and it eats up our IDCs. Feel like a dog around town?
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2016
  6. Gandalf

    Gandalf Greenie Member

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    I go over 400 on the Vdyno when I choose the Dynojet setting.
     
  7. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Here is an excel chart I done to correct the blips in the TQ curve. Actual results were 410/415. Just a representation to show you the power curve.

    upload_2016-2-14_13-3-39.png
    [doublepost=1455473118][/doublepost]
    This was an actual dyno on a set of rollers.
    [​IMG]
     

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  8. Redline

    Redline I done fucked up for the last time. BANNED Greenie Member

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    HTA3582, right? That power on 93 is o.0 but I'd definitely not go nearly so big myself in favor of responsiveness.
     
  9. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    @Redline HTA3586. The responsiveness isn't all that terrible. Spool isn't bad either. I can hit 35psi a butthair shy of 4k rpms with it.
     
  10. Redline

    Redline I done fucked up for the last time. BANNED Greenie Member

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    Ahhh, the 86 version. Wow, that thing flows a lot. I'd be interested to see how the EFR9180 compares if you can ever get it shoehorned in ;)
     
  11. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    video if anyone cares
     
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  12. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Try and do something to see what happens and the haters come out. Apparently, I'm trying to make a name for myself and create a buzz. I'm presuming for tuning. A tuning service I don't even fucking offer. I tune my car and a few friends. That's it. I'm attacked on my end for a tune to my own car. Yet, there's a guy Russell Culliver from Dead Hook Motorsports proclaiming he tunes to 13.8:1 AFR...E or not. That's some hot ass cylinders. Either way. I wanted 400whp b/c I was told it was "impossible" in another facebook post that swirled out of control.

    Also included the datalog from my dyno run.

    upload_2016-2-17_13-51-15.png
     

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  13. Maisonvi

    Maisonvi Silver Member

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    I mean you did it and have proof. I didnt think it was possible up till now, so Im impressed. Would I run my car to that kind of limit? No, but thats not the point. You had a goal and you did it. Congrats on that if it means anything. Now add fuel so you can make a lot more, because your set up clearly can.
     
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  14. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Thanks. You're right. It wasn't mean to be a DD tune. I wanted to see how far it could make it. I have another project I may pursue to push the stock fueling even more. I blame @Enki
     
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  15. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    I think everyone is all uppity because you think he did this to prove you wrong, but I'd wager he did this just to see if he could. Hell, the only reason he posted it here is because I asked him to just to see the response he'd get. Obviously he wouldn't stay like this since he's got way more airflow and fueling he can add to this (and has in the past).
     
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  16. blackms3_71

    blackms3_71 Silver Member

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    blackms3_71, via a mobile device, Feb 17, 2016
    #56
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  17. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Next stop is 404whp @ 6500rpms on stock injectors w/o aux fueling. Made some revisions to a new map. Trying to maximize the injection window the most I can. Only spinning the motor to 6700rpms and calling for more boost in the 5500-6500rpms and tapering it down after 6500. Don't try and throw this into vdyno. It just started sprinkling and the pavement just wet enough to make my R compounds hate life. I tried to get'r done before it came but was too late. If you notice the IDC's at 6000-6500rpms on my dyno log versus this one you can see there's definitely more power being made.

    So right now plan is to get as much as I can between 5500-6500rpms on pump gas, possibly dyno to see where that lands on pump gas. Then I'm going to throw in a couple pails of 102 octane and try to push the timing and see where she lands. The magic number is 404wtq @ 6500rpms.
     

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  18. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    Things happen and you somehow end up with 29.2psi on 93 pump gas. She felt pretty quick and IDC's weren't as crazy as you would think. More to come.
     
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  19. Maisonvi

    Maisonvi Silver Member

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    Interested to see the data from that.
     
  20. Poon_Flavored_Tang

    Poon_Flavored_Tang Greenie Member

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    25psipumpgasonly4.jpg
    I'll have some data soon. Trying to sort out some issues.
    [doublepost=1456365357][/doublepost]A little more controlled spool and keep in mind this is still on 93 octane and no secondary injection. I'm going to try and push up to 27ish psi as long as KR is okay. 29 is definitely going to be more than the stock fueling supply can handle. Keep in mind I'm still on the stock ITFP too.
     

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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2016
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