Some NEWB E85 Questions

Discussion in 'Mazdaspeed 3/6 E85/CornFed' started by rang-a-stang, Mar 9, 2021.

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  1. Duey1083

    Duey1083 Gold Member

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    This was a super handy thread. Thanks @Enki and @Awafrican for the info and links.

    I'd struggle a bit with releasing those retainer clips on the internals for sure. I can't recall what all the pieces are called.

    I need to finish welding my bench so I can mount my vice already.
     
    Duey1083, via a Samsung mobile device, Mar 11, 2021
    #21
  2. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    Why is it an issue? Are you using CS internals? If stock, you can just pull the internals out the back without even removing the nut from the pump. Twist and pull. If CS internals, just push them through backwards enough to release pressure on the spring and drop them out that way.
     
  3. Awafrican

    Awafrican Moderator Silver Member

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    Awafrican, via a mobile device, Mar 11, 2021
    #23
  4. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    You don't need to do that though; just push the internals further into the nut with your thumb and the spring should unseat.
    Take the collar off first.
     
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  5. Duey1083

    Duey1083 Gold Member

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    I have Autotechs installed right now.

    Doesn't look too bad that way. For some reason I didnt see the box end wrench on that photo. Smart!

    @Enki, ah I see...after removing the collar, you can pull the internals and spring out as one assembly and clean like that.

    Is it okay to clean using non-chlorinated brake cleaner in the pump?

    Sorry for the thread hi-Jack @rang-a-stang ...assuming you don't mind since you asked about cleaning.
     
    Duey1083, via a Samsung mobile device, Mar 11, 2021
    #25
  6. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    Use gasoline or lighter fluid (naphtha).
     
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  7. Awafrican

    Awafrican Moderator Silver Member

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    MMM naphtha
     
    Awafrican, via a mobile device, Mar 11, 2021
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  8. MindTheG4p

    MindTheG4p Greenie Member

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    Since I'm going to be rebuilding my HPFP w/ the E-85 safe o-rings, following this thread. I have E85 stations near me (in MD) so the goal is to have Freektune provide both a 93 and an E30 tune.

    I did notice the comment re: Rotella T6 mucking things up, and given all the...opinions I've read on it, I'm curious - why do people recommend Rotella T6 for the MS3 engine so much? Most (if not all) of what I've seen is anecdotally related to 'diesel oil has more detergents in it' but then I see people recommending Royal Purple 5w-30 as the 'best' so I'm confused why people think Rotella is the way to go.
     
  9. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    Nobody in this thread nor the best oils thread has mentioned Rotella as being good.
     
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  10. Awafrican

    Awafrican Moderator Silver Member

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    Rotella is old school when it was the "best" option for us and the Facebook weenies won't go away from it and read the data that says it's bad you want a dexos 2 oil like royal purple or tribodyn. That being said read this thread and the thread it links too should answer your questions with actual used oil analysis
    https://mazdaspeeds.org/index.php?threads/best-engine-oil-all-mod-levels.7931/

    Edit: no one around here that's worth listening too will recommend Rotella these days
     
    Awafrican, via a mobile device, Mar 18, 2021
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  11. MindTheG4p

    MindTheG4p Greenie Member

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    I didn't say anyone here recommended it, just that in the large amount of reading elsewhere (MS3 forums, Reddit, etc) I see it come up frequently enough that I was confused why (even Bob the Oil Guy has an older VOA for it that seemingly recommended it for DI), esp with the comment in this specific thread saying it 'mucks things up.' I did review the oil thread and will be using the RP for my next change though, thanks.

    Back to on topic - are there any things to look out for when swapping in the E85 o-rings as points of concern? As in - should I be looking for wear on anything in particular that would warrant a new pump / changing anything besides the internals + o-rings?
     
  12. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    I don't use specialty orings in my HPFP. The only detriment to not using them is when you go to rebuild after being on full e85 they will be a bit swollen and need to dry out before reassembly. For this reason, I have a spare set of stock orings and have yet to have any real oring related issues.
     
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  13. MindTheG4p

    MindTheG4p Greenie Member

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    Thank you for sharing your expertise - much appreciated.
     
  14. rang-a-stang

    rang-a-stang Greenie Member

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    When tuning for E85, I assume I will get some more boost on the top end. With my current setup and tune, I am a hair under 21psi. Logs do not show boost leaks with my stock/original bypass valve at this level. Should I consider that more boost will need a newer/aftermarket bypass valve?
     
    rang-a-stang, via an iPhone, Apr 13, 2021
    #34
  15. Sho

    Sho Greenie Member

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    Stock fueling? If so. Probably not much injector headroom to squeeze a lot more boost out of it. Probably be able to add a bit more ignition timing though
     
    Sho, via a mobile device, Apr 13, 2021
    #35
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  16. Easter Bunny

    Easter Bunny Professional Engineer Platinum Member

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    You need a new bpv when it leaks. The stock one uses boost pressure to help seal so it's actually pretty stout
     
    Easter Bunny, via a mobile device, Apr 13, 2021
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  17. Enki

    Enki Motorhead Platinum Member

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    Tuning on corn will net you more flow, which generally results in a drop in boost pressure for a given load/massflow.
    You will be able to run more boost as a result of the increased octane, on top of being able to increase timing, but just putting corn in the tank isn't going to increase your boost pressure.
     
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  18. rang-a-stang

    rang-a-stang Greenie Member

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    That all makes sense. I am doing a TMIC and a Cobb downpipe at the same time. I plan to install DP and TMIC, have a Freek tune for 91 octane. Then run another freek tune for corn. I have not seen boost loses so far and don’t want to swap the BPV if I don’t have to. Sounds like I should be fine.
     
    rang-a-stang, via an iPhone, Apr 13, 2021
    #38
  19. rang-a-stang

    rang-a-stang Greenie Member

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    Oh my! Two years since I started "thinking" about this?!

    Pumped my first tank of E33 this morning (5 gallons E85, topped off with 91), flashed my first Freak E-tune version, and headed to work. I only have about 9 miles on it, but do notice my idle seems a little smoother. More to follow.
     
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  20. rang-a-stang

    rang-a-stang Greenie Member

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    On second MAP iteration. HOLY CRAP!!! Ethanol! Where you been all my life?! My car runs much smoother (both at idle and cruising). My throttle response is better. The mid RPM power surge is AMAZING...which makes 3rd and 4th gear insane! WGDC is still around 65% at WOT and boost is slightly higher (a hair under 22) but the power difference is nuts! I now have significant traction problems in 3rd gear.

    Only concerns I have right now are:
    1) My Injector duty cycle is around 95% at 5500 RPM and up and hit 98% twice in the last log. Should this make me nervous?
    2) I also notice my HPFP actual pressure is 1200'ish when Injector duty cycle is >90%. The AFR seems consistent but I thought HPFP should always be >1700psi. I have Autotech internals. Can I get better from say, a Cobb set? (there is a Cobb set on my local Craigslist for a decent price right now).
    3) With gas and E85 costs climbing, the ratio of lost MPG vs. lower fuel cost is closing. I can't really tell what the difference is because I cannot keep my foot out of it but I am going to assume it's 15-20% lower. Right now, in my area, E85 is about 25% cheaper than 91 octane.
     
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